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techtalk:ih:oil03 [2019/12/19 05:29] hippysmack |
techtalk:ih:oil03 [2020/11/07 04:19] hippysmack [Oil Pump Pressure (57-85)] |
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* [[techtalk:ref:oil06|Comparing the 77 Style Oil Pump to Newer Pumps]] | * [[techtalk:ref:oil06|Comparing the 77 Style Oil Pump to Newer Pumps]] | ||
+ | ====== Oil Pump Function ====== | ||
+ | |||
+ | The oil pump is a positive displacement unit. \\ | ||
+ | If you block the discharge flow path, discharge pressure will rise and literally approaches infinity until something fails. ((BuckIRyder of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=730325&page=2)) \\ | ||
+ | It's non-regulated and delivers its entire volume of oil under pressure to the oil filter mount. \\ | ||
+ | However, don't take the term "positive displacement pump" literally. ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1429178&page=2)) \\ | ||
+ | Compared to a centrifigal pump, gear / gerotor type pumps use displacement to function. \\ | ||
+ | How positive it is depends on what it's pumping. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | The most 'positive' pump on our bikes may be the master cyl for the disc brakes. \\ | ||
+ | You pull the lever and it pumps real good, positive, unless there is air in the system. \\ | ||
+ | Then you still get the displacement but not the pressure because liquid is not compressable but air is. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | Gear / gerotor type pumps work by filling the spaces between the teeth with whatever it is that is being pumped (oil in our case). \\ | ||
+ | The oil in the tooth spaces gets squezed out of the spaces when the gear teeth mesh together (because a tooth is now in that space. \\ | ||
+ | But there is still a little space left at full mesh. \\ | ||
+ | Gearotor pumps have a smaller space at full mesh than gear pumps. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | Now when the mesh breaks, a void is created. Oil gets sucked into that void. \\ | ||
+ | Now what if air is in the spaces instead of oil? \\ | ||
+ | It gets sqeezed out also unless there is pressure (restriction) in the curcuit its trying to flow into. \\ | ||
+ | In that case, some air stays in the spaces and gets compressed in the small space remaining as the teeth mesh. \\ | ||
+ | When the teeth unmesh, air expands (refilling void that should be getting oil sucked into it. \\ | ||
+ | The pump can't make enough pressure to overcome the exit restriction. \\ | ||
+ | Then there is no flow and no ability to reprime itself since. \\ | ||
+ | (it's not making enough suction due to the expansion of the compressed air refilling the void that the oil should be filling) \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | Eventually the pressure in the return line gets released. \\ | ||
+ | While this is happening oil is building up in the pickup sump and waiting for the return side to come back online. \\ | ||
+ | The supply pump is still pumping while the return is toggling from air locked to primed and pumping. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | Think about what state the return oil is in as it collects in the return pickup cavity. It's just been thru a 60 cycle blender. \\ | ||
+ | Our bikes live with that every mile they travel with lots of air whipped into every drop of return oil. \\ | ||
+ | Restrictions in the return side of the pump will lead to a more sustained oil level in the crankcase sump. \\ | ||
+ | (large enough to reduce outflow from the engine to a volume less than the supply pump is feeding the engine) \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | This is a condition known as wetsumping. \\ | ||
+ | Read more about [[techtalk:ref:oil10|wetsumping]] in the REF section of the Sportsterpedia. \\ | ||
===== Production Oil Pumps ===== | ===== Production Oil Pumps ===== | ||
- | * There are 3 basic pumps ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) | + | * There are 3 basic pumps & 2 basic plumbing styles ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) |
- | - 57-E62 (3 variations) these use 16t body gears. | + | |
- | - L62-71 (2 variations) these use 14t | + | |
- | - 72-76 (no variations) use 16t again | + | |
- | * & 2 basic plumbing styles: ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) | + | |
- Both feed and return are drilled passages in the right crankcase (57-66 all) & (67-69 xlch) | - Both feed and return are drilled passages in the right crankcase (57-66 all) & (67-69 xlch) | ||
- Only return drilled thru case. feed goes from tank to pump by external hose. (67-69 xlh) & (70-76 all) | - Only return drilled thru case. feed goes from tank to pump by external hose. (67-69 xlh) & (70-76 all) | ||
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* The stock slot in pre -72 pump gear is .375" ((chevelle of the XLFORUM® http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=989934&page=2)) | * The stock slot in pre -72 pump gear is .375" ((chevelle of the XLFORUM® http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=989934&page=2)) | ||
* The stock slot in post -72 pump gear is .625" ((chevelle of the XLFORUM® http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=989934&page=2)) | * The stock slot in post -72 pump gear is .625" ((chevelle of the XLFORUM® http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=989934&page=2)) | ||
- | |||
- | | Oil Pump on 1967 XLCH ((photos by ss396 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1864035&highlight=Ironhead+Crankcase+Drain+Plug&page=4)) | Oil Pump on 1972 XLH ((photo by deedub97gt of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?page=17&t=1637849)) | | ||
- | |{{:techtalk:ih:oil:1967_xlch_oil_pump_1_by_ss396.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ih:oil:1967_xlch_oil_pump_2_by_ss396.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ih:oil:oil_pump_on_72_ih_by_deedub97gt.jpg?direct&300|}}| | ||
On some pump casting bodies you may see an Allen plug in the back of the pump. ((Monte03 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=563241)) \\ | On some pump casting bodies you may see an Allen plug in the back of the pump. ((Monte03 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=563241)) \\ | ||
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In 1972 and with the birth of the 1000cc engine, the pump numbers were -72. \\ | In 1972 and with the birth of the 1000cc engine, the pump numbers were -72. \\ | ||
It had larger gears and a bigger breather slot. \\ | It had larger gears and a bigger breather slot. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | | Oil Pump on 1967 XLCH ((photos by ss396 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1864035&highlight=Ironhead+Crankcase+Drain+Plug&page=4)) | Oil Pump on 1972 XLH ((photo by deedub97gt of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?page=17&t=1637849)) | | ||
+ | |{{:techtalk:ih:oil:1967_xlch_oil_pump_1_by_ss396.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ih:oil:1967_xlch_oil_pump_2_by_ss396.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ih:oil:oil_pump_on_72_ih_by_deedub97gt.jpg?direct&300|}}| | ||
+ | |||
===== 1957-E1962 ===== | ===== 1957-E1962 ===== | ||
- | * All these use 16t gear sets and style 1 plumbing ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) | + | * There are (3 variations) and these all use 16t gear sets and style 1 plumbing ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) |
- | * Gear Dia. (1.115" OD) | + | * Feed gears: |
- | * Feed gears (.185" thick) | + | * O.D. (1.115" OD) ((needspeed of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5795112#post5795112)) |
+ | * Width (.185") ((needspeed of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5795112#post5795112)) | ||
+ | * Return gears" | ||
+ | * Width (?) | ||
+ | * Driven gear: | ||
+ | * Center hole I.D. (.422") ((kitabel of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5792413#post5792413)) | ||
+ | * Idler gear: | ||
+ | * Center hole I.D. (.422") ((kitabel of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5792413#post5792413)) | ||
* The production changes made during its run: ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) | * The production changes made during its run: ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) | ||
* 57-e58 baseline pump that all others came from. \\ No oil seal. \\ Uses a snap ring and a full profile woodruff key at scavenge gear. | * 57-e58 baseline pump that all others came from. \\ No oil seal. \\ Uses a snap ring and a full profile woodruff key at scavenge gear. | ||
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===== L1962-1971 ===== | ===== L1962-1971 ===== | ||
- | * All these used 14t gears & scavenge sets got taller than the previous 16's were. ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) | + | * There are (2 variations) and all these used 14t gears & scavenge sets got taller than the previous 16's were. ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) |
- | * Gear Dia. (.990" OD) | + | * Feed gears: |
- | * Feed gears (.216" thick) | + | * O.D. (.990" OD) ((needspeed of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5795112#post5795112)) |
- | * All use half moons and shortened key on scavenge drive. | + | * Width (.216") ((needspeed of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5795112#post5795112)) |
- | * Bodies made till '66 are for style 1 plumbing. | + | * Return gears: |
- | * In '67, the body gets tapped for the external feed fitting for use on 67-69 XLH. This is when style2 plumbing started. | + | * Width (?) |
- | * Bodies tapped for style2 were still used on the last 3 yrs (67-69 xlch) of style1 cases. | + | * Driven gear: |
- | * A plug is put in this new hole if body got used on a style1 case set. | + | * Center hole I.D. (.422") ((kitabel of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5792413#post5792413)) |
+ | * Idler gear: | ||
+ | * Center hole I.D. (.422") ((kitabel of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5792413#post5792413)) | ||
+ | * All use half moons and shortened key on scavenge drive. | ||
+ | * Bodies made till '66 are for style 1 plumbing. | ||
+ | * In '67, the body gets tapped for the external feed fitting for use on 67-69 XLH. This is when style2 plumbing started. | ||
+ | * Bodies tapped for style2 were still used on the last 3 yrs (67-69 xlch) of style1 cases. | ||
+ | * A plug is put in this new hole if body got used on a style1 case set. | ||
===== 1972-1976 ===== | ===== 1972-1976 ===== | ||
- | * These go back to 16t gears and a snap ring with long key ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) | + | * These have (no variations) and go back to 16t gears and a snap ring with long key ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) |
- | * Gear Dia. (1.115" OD) | + | * Feed gears: |
- | * Feed gears (.185" thick) | + | * O.D. (1.115" OD) ((needspeed of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5795112#post5795112)) |
+ | * Width (.185") ((needspeed of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5795112#post5795112)) | ||
+ | * Return gears" | ||
+ | * Width (?) | ||
+ | * Driven gear: | ||
+ | * Center hole I.D. (.422") ((kitabel of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5792413#post5792413)) | ||
+ | * Idler gear: | ||
+ | * Center hole I.D. (.422") ((kitabel of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5792413#post5792413)) | ||
* Feed gears are the same as 57-e62 but the scavenge set is now wider again (wider than any of the previous sets). | * Feed gears are the same as 57-e62 but the scavenge set is now wider again (wider than any of the previous sets). | ||
* Breather gear gets enlarged slots in it. ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) | * Breather gear gets enlarged slots in it. ((Dr Dick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3272806&postcount=204)) | ||
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{{:techtalk:ih:oil:oil_pressure_gauge_1_by_dieselox4.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Dieselox4 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1456449)) {{:techtalk:ih:oil:oil_pressure_gauge_2_by_dieselox4.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Dieselox4 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1456449)) | {{:techtalk:ih:oil:oil_pressure_gauge_1_by_dieselox4.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Dieselox4 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1456449)) {{:techtalk:ih:oil:oil_pressure_gauge_2_by_dieselox4.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Dieselox4 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1456449)) | ||
+ | ====== Oil Pump - Complete Unit Part Numbers ====== | ||
====== 1957-1976 Gear Driven Pumps ====== | ====== 1957-1976 Gear Driven Pumps ====== | ||
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{{:techtalk:ih:oil:77-_85_oil_pump_drawing_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&400|}} ((drawing by Hippysmack)) {{:techtalk:ih:oil:77-85_oil_pump_feed_transfer_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Hippysmack)) | {{:techtalk:ih:oil:77-_85_oil_pump_drawing_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&400|}} ((drawing by Hippysmack)) {{:techtalk:ih:oil:77-85_oil_pump_feed_transfer_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Hippysmack)) | ||
- | |||
* This pump has two hose fittings; ((ironheadjunkie of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1400314&page=2)) | * This pump has two hose fittings; ((ironheadjunkie of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1400314&page=2)) | ||
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* Then, the oil will return from the front fitting of the oil pump to the oil tank. | * Then, the oil will return from the front fitting of the oil pump to the oil tank. | ||
+ | {{:techtalk:evo:oil:oil_pressure_switch_threads_by_hippysmack.png?direct&300|}} ((drawing by Hippysmack)) \\ | ||
===== Production Oil Pumps ===== | ===== Production Oil Pumps ===== | ||
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* Another way to prime the pump is to use assembly lube on the gerotors and inside of the pump before installing it. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4805186#post4805186)) \\ Then you have an instant hydraulic seal to help the oil pump suck oil from the hose. | * Another way to prime the pump is to use assembly lube on the gerotors and inside of the pump before installing it. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4805186#post4805186)) \\ Then you have an instant hydraulic seal to help the oil pump suck oil from the hose. | ||
* You can also using a large syringe with a tapered tip inserted into the oil supply hose on the bottom of the oil tank. ((ericfreeman of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5751479#post5751479)) \\ Then you can force feed oil the pump and on to the engine using this technique and it avoids having to mess with the sending unit. | * You can also using a large syringe with a tapered tip inserted into the oil supply hose on the bottom of the oil tank. ((ericfreeman of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5751479#post5751479)) \\ Then you can force feed oil the pump and on to the engine using this technique and it avoids having to mess with the sending unit. | ||
+ | * With this homemade tool, all you have to do is use a grease gun (without grease) filled with oil and pump it into the system so a dry start can be avoided. {{:techtalk:ref:tools:check_ball_tester_and_prelube_fitting_by_bustert.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by bustert of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1813185&page=2)) | ||