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techtalk:ref:genmsr05 [2024/01/17 03:12] hippysmack |
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| ===== Apparel ===== | ===== Apparel ===== | ||
| - | |||
| Any loose snaps or buttons on shirts, jackets etc. will flap around in the wind. \\ | Any loose snaps or buttons on shirts, jackets etc. will flap around in the wind. \\ | ||
| Any of those on or near your helmet can repeatedly slap against it. \\ | Any of those on or near your helmet can repeatedly slap against it. \\ | ||
| Line 250: | Line 249: | ||
| ===== Helmet ===== | ===== Helmet ===== | ||
| - | |||
| The snaps holding the visor on the helmet can slap against it in the wind. | The snaps holding the visor on the helmet can slap against it in the wind. | ||
| The metal clasp on the chin strap can also do this if you forget to tighten it. \\ | The metal clasp on the chin strap can also do this if you forget to tighten it. \\ | ||
| Line 258: | Line 256: | ||
| ===== Straps / Hold Downs ===== | ===== Straps / Hold Downs ===== | ||
| - | |||
| Secure all straps and hold down cords etc. especially when not in use. \\ | Secure all straps and hold down cords etc. especially when not in use. \\ | ||
| It's best to keep them in a saddlebag or home when not in use. \\ | It's best to keep them in a saddlebag or home when not in use. \\ | ||
| Line 268: | Line 265: | ||
| During left hand corners, it will scrape the ground. Replacing the spring is pretty simple though. \\ | During left hand corners, it will scrape the ground. Replacing the spring is pretty simple though. \\ | ||
| When you check the side stand spring, be sure to look at the bushings as well (if applicable). They are also a wear item. ((sportsterpaul of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1964704&highlight=noises&page=3)) \\ | When you check the side stand spring, be sure to look at the bushings as well (if applicable). They are also a wear item. ((sportsterpaul of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1964704&highlight=noises&page=3)) \\ | ||
| - | Have someone hold the bike up, fold the kickstand up and shake it. There should be almost no movement at the pivot. ((Toejam503 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5699298&highlight=motor+mount+noise#post5699298)) \\ | + | Have someone hold the bike up, fold the kickstand up and shake it. There should be almost no movement at the pivot. ((Toejam503 of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/194787-1986-1987-owners-kickstand-question?highlight=motor+mount+noise#post5699298)) \\ |
| ====== Shrouded Noises ====== | ====== Shrouded Noises ====== | ||
| - | With a half helmet and no windshield; ((Gone of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=823082)) \\ | + | With a half helmet and no windshield; ((Gone of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/efi-sportster-motorcycle-talk-2007-and-up/97463-engine-noise?t=823082)) \\ |
| Up to 60 MPH it sounds like a hundred or two very busy blacksmith shops. \\ | Up to 60 MPH it sounds like a hundred or two very busy blacksmith shops. \\ | ||
| Over 60 it was just the wind. \\ | Over 60 it was just the wind. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| ===== Windshield ===== | ===== Windshield ===== | ||
| A windshield can direct noises straight at you while riding. \\ | A windshield can direct noises straight at you while riding. \\ | ||
| It makes them more pronounced where little things sound a lot worse than they are. \\ | It makes them more pronounced where little things sound a lot worse than they are. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| ===== Helmet ===== | ===== Helmet ===== | ||
| - | |||
| Helmet style also plays a part in how much noise you here. \\ | Helmet style also plays a part in how much noise you here. \\ | ||
| - | |||
| A full helmet covers your ears and will mask 'close' sounds and how loud sounds are in general. \\ | A full helmet covers your ears and will mask 'close' sounds and how loud sounds are in general. \\ | ||
| (foam mounted on the inside for sound/heat purposes) \\ | (foam mounted on the inside for sound/heat purposes) \\ | ||
| Line 290: | Line 287: | ||
| ===== Exhaust Pipes ===== | ===== Exhaust Pipes ===== | ||
| - | |||
| Granted, loud exhaust pipes are part of the Harley experience. \\ | Granted, loud exhaust pipes are part of the Harley experience. \\ | ||
| However, the louder the pipes are, the harder it is to hear other noises in the engine. \\ | However, the louder the pipes are, the harder it is to hear other noises in the engine. \\ | ||
| - | |||
| ====== Noises After Dropping the Bike ====== | ====== Noises After Dropping the Bike ====== | ||
| - | |||
| **Symptoms**: \\ | **Symptoms**: \\ | ||
| New noises coming from wheel areas. \\ | New noises coming from wheel areas. \\ | ||
| Line 302: | Line 296: | ||
| **Conditions**: \\ | **Conditions**: \\ | ||
| Bent rotors: \\ | Bent rotors: \\ | ||
| - | Rocks / debris stuck between the caliper and rotor (especially on gravel driveways). ((brianbbs67 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1844704&highlight=tire+noise)) \\ | + | Rocks / debris stuck between the caliper and rotor (especially on gravel driveways). ((brianbbs67 of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/172102-so-i-dropped-my-new-bike-and-now?t=1844704&highlight=tire+noise)) \\ |
| - | Caliper knocked loose / damaged. ((Dirt Hill of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1844704&highlight=tire+noise)) \\ | + | Caliper knocked loose / damaged. ((Dirt Hill of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/172102-so-i-dropped-my-new-bike-and-now?t=1844704&highlight=tire+noise)) \\ |
| - | Fender rub from bent or tweaked fenders. ((mikeLI_77 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1894772&highlight=wheel+bearing+noise)) \\ | + | Fender rub from bent or tweaked fenders. ((mikeLI_77 of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-drivetrain/sportster-motorcycle-tires-wheels-and-brakes-aa/176577-trying-to-identify-a-noise-video-included?t=1894772&highlight=wheel+bearing+noise)) \\ |
| ====== Electrical Noises ====== | ====== Electrical Noises ====== | ||
| + | \\ | ||
| ===== VOES Switch ===== | ===== VOES Switch ===== | ||
| - | The VOES switch makes a chirping sound when it's switching. ((Mojo 5533 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1529681&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) \\ | + | The VOES switch makes a chirping sound when it's switching. ((Mojo 5533 of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/141144-off-light-throttle-chirping-sound/page2?t=1529681&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) \\ |
| This is normal. \\ | This is normal. \\ | ||
| ===== Generator Noises ===== | ===== Generator Noises ===== | ||
| - | |||
| The generator should be 2 or 3 times noisier than the other points. \\ | The generator should be 2 or 3 times noisier than the other points. \\ | ||
| - | Generators are notorious for sounding like marbles are clattering around in a bucket. ((fergerburger of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=832376&page=6)) \\ | + | Generators are notorious for sounding like marbles are clattering around in a bucket. ((fergerburger of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/98047-ironhead-noise/page6?t=832376&page=6)) \\ |
| - | New, out of the box, generators are a little loud until they are worn in. ((hcrashster of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5241155&highlight=stethoscope#post5241155)) \\ | + | New, out of the box, generators are a little loud until they are worn in. ((hcrashster of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/178616-wiring-complete-and-a-new-gennie?highlight=stethoscope#post3818357)) \\ |
| The bearings, shaft and even the brushes take a few miles to settle down. \\ | The bearings, shaft and even the brushes take a few miles to settle down. \\ | ||
| Aftermarket generator gear quality is not the highest, or the parent material the gear is machined from for that matter. | Aftermarket generator gear quality is not the highest, or the parent material the gear is machined from for that matter. | ||
| - | If the generator is suspect, you could take the genny out. ((Fridge of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4875150&highlight=motor+mount+noise#post4875150)) \\ | + | If the generator is suspect, you could take the genny out. ((Fridge of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/166281-name-that-noise?highlight=motor+mount+noise#post3544045)) \\ |
| Fab a blank off plate to cover the opening and start it and run it for a very short period of time and see if it goes away. \\ | Fab a blank off plate to cover the opening and start it and run it for a very short period of time and see if it goes away. \\ | ||
| - | |||
| ====== Engine Noises ====== | ====== Engine Noises ====== | ||
| - | Do this before you do anything else, try to locate the noise before you tear it down. ((flflash of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1775548&highlight=loose+motor+mount&page=3)) \\ | + | Do this before you do anything else, try to locate the noise before you tear it down. ((flflash of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/165035-evo-engine-clatter-please-watch-video/page3?t=1775548&highlight=loose+motor+mount&page=3)) \\ |
| Determine which side of the engine it's on, then whether its top end, cylinder or crankcase. \\ | Determine which side of the engine it's on, then whether its top end, cylinder or crankcase. \\ | ||
| Line 340: | Line 332: | ||
| Worn or defective oil pump. \\ | Worn or defective oil pump. \\ | ||
| - | First response, check for piston skirt, or perhaps lifter damage. ((Dave1200s of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=3188980&highlight=stethoscope#post3188980)) \\ | + | First response, check for piston skirt, or perhaps lifter damage. ((Dave1200s of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/113369-ran-oil-low-and-now-clacking-sound?highlight=stethoscope#post2380434)) \\ |
| The lifter rollers will survive on oil mist, except maybe under sustained maximal rpm where the oil provides a bit of cooling. \\ | The lifter rollers will survive on oil mist, except maybe under sustained maximal rpm where the oil provides a bit of cooling. \\ | ||
| - | If the bike sits for a long period of time, the oil may settle at the bottom of the engine. ((mikeLI_77 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=3722)) \\ | + | If the bike sits for a long period of time, the oil may settle at the bottom of the engine. ((mikeLI_77 of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/rubber-mount-sportster-motorcycle-talk-2004-2006/2512-motor-noise?t=3722)) \\ |
| This may leave the top end with not much oil at all. \\ | This may leave the top end with not much oil at all. \\ | ||
| The valves and / or lifters could make some noise until the oil pushes them back up. \\ | The valves and / or lifters could make some noise until the oil pushes them back up. \\ | ||
| Line 356: | Line 348: | ||
| **Conditions**: \\ | **Conditions**: \\ | ||
| - | Split, leaking, missing or obstructed vacuum lines on any of the vacuum operated devices and respective hoses. ((BeezrGeezr of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1819997&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) \\ | + | Split, leaking, missing or obstructed vacuum lines on any of the vacuum operated devices and respective hoses. ((BeezrGeezr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/169618-strange-noise-coming-from-somewhere-near-carb/page2?t=1819997&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) \\ |
| - | + | Visually inspect lines and vacuum operated devices. ((BeezrGeezr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/169618-strange-noise-coming-from-somewhere-near-carb/page2?t=1819997&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) \\ | |
| - | Visually inspect lines and vacuum operated devices. ((BeezrGeezr of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1819997&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) \\ | + | |
| Also inspect any rubber fittings or caps for cracks or splits (especially around Voes or Map sensors, if applicable). \\ | Also inspect any rubber fittings or caps for cracks or splits (especially around Voes or Map sensors, if applicable). \\ | ||
| You can use a stethoscope to probe any of these areas also. \\ | You can use a stethoscope to probe any of these areas also. \\ | ||
| Line 366: | Line 357: | ||
| ===== Knock / Ping / Detonation ===== | ===== Knock / Ping / Detonation ===== | ||
| - | + | Overheating can be caused by poor octane fuel (knocking/pinging). ((jessearias of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/124708-loud-tapping-front-cyl-exhaust-note-change-help?highlight=stethoscope#post2615797)) \\ | |
| - | Overheating can be caused by poor octane fuel (knocking/pinging). ((jessearias of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=3539328&highlight=stethoscope#post3539328)) \\ | + | |
| It does not have to be audibly pinging to be causing damage. \\ | It does not have to be audibly pinging to be causing damage. \\ | ||
| When it gets to the point where you can hear it, it is pretty severe. \\ | When it gets to the point where you can hear it, it is pretty severe. \\ | ||
| But, the subtle detonation you do not or barely hear that tears the motor up. \\ | But, the subtle detonation you do not or barely hear that tears the motor up. \\ | ||
| - | Detonation can and will put a hole in a piston and/or scorch valve landings. ((bitpusher of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=3539328&highlight=stethoscope#post3539328)) \\ | + | Detonation can and will put a hole in a piston and/or scorch valve landings. ((bitpusher of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/124708-loud-tapping-front-cyl-exhaust-note-change-help?highlight=stethoscope#post2615797)) \\ |
| - | It is also most likely to cause damage to the ring landings. ((steelworker of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=3539328&highlight=stethoscope#post3539328)) \\ | + | It is also most likely to cause damage to the ring landings. ((steelworker of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/124708-loud-tapping-front-cyl-exhaust-note-change-help?highlight=stethoscope#post2615797)) \\ |
| **Symptoms**: \\ | **Symptoms**: \\ | ||
| Sounds like a little gnome inside the cylinder tapping the sides with a little hammer. \\ | Sounds like a little gnome inside the cylinder tapping the sides with a little hammer. \\ | ||
| - | It's also akin to sounds of marbles in your cylinder. ((Benton of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1575186&highlight=stethoscope&page=3)) \\ | + | It's also akin to sounds of marbles in your cylinder. ((Benton of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/145132-86-sportster-top-end-ticking-please-help/page3?t=1575186&highlight=stethoscope&page=3)) \\ |
| - | Detonation sounds (and feels) nothing like valve train noise, normal or oil starved. ((bitpusher of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1510117&page=2)) \\ | + | Detonation sounds (and feels) nothing like valve train noise, normal or oil starved. ((bitpusher of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-engine-conversions/139164-more-upper-mechanical-noise-as-engine-gets-hot/page2?t=1510117&page=2)) \\ |
| A low level knock coming from the cylinders, most noticeable at idle. | A low level knock coming from the cylinders, most noticeable at idle. | ||
| Line 388: | Line 378: | ||
| Conversions that are not compatible. | Conversions that are not compatible. | ||
| - | Try draining the carb and adding some octane boost to the tank. If the noise goes away, it's detonation. ((jazzman of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1575186&highlight=stethoscope&page=3)) \\ | + | Try draining the carb and adding some octane boost to the tank. If the noise goes away, it's detonation. ((jazzman of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/145132-86-sportster-top-end-ticking-please-help/page3?t=1575186&highlight=stethoscope&page=3)) \\ |
| If not, check your timing. It may be too advanced. \\ | If not, check your timing. It may be too advanced. \\ | ||
| Line 394: | Line 384: | ||
| |{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:timer_plate_directions_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&400|}}| | |{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:timer_plate_directions_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&400|}}| | ||
| - | |This piston is just about to break from too much \\ cylinder pressure. This is from a race motor using \\ Nitromethane ((photo by aswracing of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=616889))|Broken piston from detonation. \\ (883/1200 conversion) ((photo by thatdirtykid of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=616889&highlight=stethoscope))| | + | |This piston is just about to break from too much \\ cylinder pressure. This is from a race motor using \\ Nitromethane ((photo by aswracing of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/82885-piston-problems-pics?t=616889))|Broken piston from detonation. \\ (883/1200 conversion) ((photo by thatdirtykid of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/82885-piston-problems-pics?t=616889&highlight=stethoscope))| |
| |{{techtalk:ref:svcproc:ringland_failure_by_aswracing.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:svcproc:detonated_piston_by_thatdirtykid.jpg?direct&300|}}| | |{{techtalk:ref:svcproc:ringland_failure_by_aswracing.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:svcproc:detonated_piston_by_thatdirtykid.jpg?direct&300|}}| | ||
| ===== Backfire ===== | ===== Backfire ===== | ||
| - | + | Backfiring through the carb is almost always a timing issue. ((doodah man of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/196329-busted-oil-line-now-popping-back-firing#post4285313)) \\ | |
| - | Backfiring through the carb is almost always a timing issue. ((doodah man of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5737892#post5737892)) \\ | + | |
| Backfiring through the exhaust pipes is almost always an issue with leaking O-rings on the manifold. \\ | Backfiring through the exhaust pipes is almost always an issue with leaking O-rings on the manifold. \\ | ||
| - | |||
| ===== Noise Cadence or Rhythm ===== | ===== Noise Cadence or Rhythm ===== | ||
| - | + | The cadence (timing) of noises can give clues to what part of the engine to inspect. ((Ferrous Head of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/107497-using-a-stethoscope-to-listen-to-the-engine/page4?t=977525&page=4)) \\ | |
| - | The cadence (timing) of noises can give clues to what part of the engine to inspect. ((Ferrous Head of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=977525&page=4)) \\ | + | |
| Listen to the timing of the noises. \\ | Listen to the timing of the noises. \\ | ||
| Some things happen at what can be deemed as "full time" while others happen at "half time" or "quarter time". \\ | Some things happen at what can be deemed as "full time" while others happen at "half time" or "quarter time". \\ | ||
| Line 414: | Line 401: | ||
| * Noise at every two crankshaft revolutions could lend to cam, cam bushing, lifter or valve train problems. | * Noise at every two crankshaft revolutions could lend to cam, cam bushing, lifter or valve train problems. | ||
| - | If need be, you could run a stopwatch and count the number of times you here the noise in a minute. ((wedge of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1535961&highlight=stethoscope&page=5)) \\ | + | If need be, you could run a stopwatch and count the number of times you here the noise in a minute. ((wedge of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/141782-engine-noise-i-m-stumped/page5?t=1535961&highlight=stethoscope&page=5)) \\ |
| Then compare that to crankshaft rpm to find the actual rhythm of the noise. \\ | Then compare that to crankshaft rpm to find the actual rhythm of the noise. \\ | ||
| - | ===== Rocker Box ===== | ||
| + | ===== Rocker Box ===== | ||
| **Symptoms**. \\ | **Symptoms**. \\ | ||
| Ticking or tapping sound. \\ | Ticking or tapping sound. \\ | ||
| Line 435: | Line 422: | ||
| **Condition**: \\ | **Condition**: \\ | ||
| - | Bad umbrella valves. ((rejeanprimeau of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1822701&highlight=stethoscope&page=4)) | + | Bad umbrella valves. ((rejeanprimeau of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/169843-whine-chirping-sound-like-a-bird-in-my-intake-or-carb/page4?t=1822701&highlight=stethoscope&page=4)) |
| ===== Heads ===== | ===== Heads ===== | ||
| - | |||
| **Symptoms**: \\ | **Symptoms**: \\ | ||
| - | A whine and chirping sound like a bird in the intake or carb. ((conv90 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1822701&highlight=stethoscope)) \\ | + | A whine and chirping sound like a bird in the intake or carb. ((conv90 of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/169843-whine-chirping-sound-like-a-bird-in-my-intake-or-carb?t=1822701&highlight=stethoscope)) \\ |
| **Condition**: \\ | **Condition**: \\ | ||
| Line 449: | Line 435: | ||
| **Symptom**: \\ | **Symptom**: \\ | ||
| - | Clanking at the head / cylinder joint. ((rottenralph of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1120515&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) \\ | + | Clanking at the head / cylinder joint. ((rottenralph of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/116484-how-long-should-it-take-to-pump-oil-to-rocker-boxs/page2?t=1120515&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) \\ |
| **Condition**: \\ | **Condition**: \\ | ||
| Loose head bolt. \\ | Loose head bolt. \\ | ||
| - | |||
| ===== Pistons ===== | ===== Pistons ===== | ||
| Line 468: | Line 453: | ||
| * The force from impact of piston to valve contact can be transferred through the rocker arm to pushrod→cam (and bearings/bushings)→pinion shaft gear→beyond. | * The force from impact of piston to valve contact can be transferred through the rocker arm to pushrod→cam (and bearings/bushings)→pinion shaft gear→beyond. | ||
| * On 88-up models, the weakest link may be the woodruff key on the pinion shaft that can shear from impact. | * On 88-up models, the weakest link may be the woodruff key on the pinion shaft that can shear from impact. | ||
| - | * Impact can damage the valve guide which can lead to oil gunk on the valve stem.Upon cold startup, the gunked up oil on the stem locks it in place. ((BlackBikeDave of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1877254&highlight=noises&page=4)) \\ | + | * Impact can damage the valve guide which can lead to oil gunk on the valve stem.Upon cold startup, the gunked up oil on the stem locks it in place. ((BlackBikeDave of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/174956-loud-clanking-on-startup/page4?t=1877254&highlight=noises&page=4)) \\ |
| * From piston to head impact: | * From piston to head impact: | ||
| * Possible cracked head or busted piston / rings, increased heat etc. \\ | * Possible cracked head or busted piston / rings, increased heat etc. \\ | ||
| Line 476: | Line 461: | ||
| * Can be caused from cams being installed out of time. | * Can be caused from cams being installed out of time. | ||
| * Can be caused from too long of pushrods or adjustable pushrods out of adjustment (being too long) especially after installing high lifts cams. | * Can be caused from too long of pushrods or adjustable pushrods out of adjustment (being too long) especially after installing high lifts cams. | ||
| - | * Also, a spun pinion gear (88-up) will set your timing off and both intake and exhaust valves can hit the pistons and bend valves and pushrods. ((wedge of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1877254&highlight=noises&page=3)) | + | * Also, a spun pinion gear (88-up) will set your timing off and both intake and exhaust valves can hit the pistons and bend valves and pushrods. ((wedge of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/174956-loud-clanking-on-startup/page3?t=1877254&highlight=noises&page=3)) |
| * A spun pinion gear is usually caused from the woodruff key shearing and the pinion gear turned off it's timing mark, throwing the cams out of time. | * A spun pinion gear is usually caused from the woodruff key shearing and the pinion gear turned off it's timing mark, throwing the cams out of time. | ||
| * Can be caused by worn/damaged rod bearings or flywheels out of true. \\ | * Can be caused by worn/damaged rod bearings or flywheels out of true. \\ | ||
| - | * Testing: Place a stethoscope on the exhaust flange to listen for piston slap. ((wedge of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5730989&highlight=listen#post5730989)) \\ If it is piston to valve contact, it will most likely show up on the exhaust flange. \\ You would need to touch the stethoscope probe directly to the flange. You can also test the intake port. \\ | + | * Testing: Place a stethoscope on the exhaust flange to listen for piston slap. ((wedge of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/196070-knocking-noise-in-front-cylinder?highlight=listen#post4276290)) \\ If it is piston to valve contact, it will most likely show up on the exhaust flange. \\ You would need to touch the stethoscope probe directly to the flange. You can also test the intake port. \\ |
| * From piston to head impact: | * From piston to head impact: | ||
| * Can be caused by worn/damaged rod bearings or flywheels out of true. | * Can be caused by worn/damaged rod bearings or flywheels out of true. | ||
| * Can be caused from improper installation. \\ Using a flywheel assembly from a previously destroyed engine without inspecting rod bearings and runout. \\ Always rotate the crank while the jugs are off and check for smooth feel and check up and down play in the rods. \\ It helps to have a quiet atmosphere. Dump oil on the bearings and listen all the way around in neutral. \\ Then spin it over by hand in before buttoning up. You can check the squish band dim with solder. | * Can be caused from improper installation. \\ Using a flywheel assembly from a previously destroyed engine without inspecting rod bearings and runout. \\ Always rotate the crank while the jugs are off and check for smooth feel and check up and down play in the rods. \\ It helps to have a quiet atmosphere. Dump oil on the bearings and listen all the way around in neutral. \\ Then spin it over by hand in before buttoning up. You can check the squish band dim with solder. | ||
| - | * Also, if the squish band has a layer of soot thick enough to touch the piston, it'll make piston slap noises. ((norseXL of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1575186&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) | + | * Also, if the squish band has a layer of soot thick enough to touch the piston, it'll make piston slap noises. ((norseXL of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/145132-86-sportster-top-end-ticking-please-help/page2?t=1575186&highlight=stethoscope&page=2)) |
| In the video below, the flywheel assembly from previous engine damage was used WITHOUT inspecting further damage to the assembly. \\ | In the video below, the flywheel assembly from previous engine damage was used WITHOUT inspecting further damage to the assembly. \\ | ||
| While the exact cause is not known on the new build, you can hear the piston making contact with the head in the video. \\ | While the exact cause is not known on the new build, you can hear the piston making contact with the head in the video. \\ | ||
| - | | Short video (L) and Pics of a 2000 Sportster with rear piston hitting the head. ((video and photos courtesy of groovemeisterus of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=2079724&page=5)) ||| | + | | Short video (L) and Pics of a 2000 Sportster with rear piston hitting the head. ((video and photos courtesy of groovemeisterus of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/202540-reasons-why-new-piston-rings-would-seize-in-fresh-rebuild/page5?t=2079724&page=5)) ||| |
| |{{:video:piston_slap_on_2000_sportster_by_groovemeisterus.mp4|}}| {{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_-_piston_to_head_contact_pic1_by_groovemeisterus.jpg?direct&280|}}| {{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_-_piston_to_head_contact_pic2_by_groovemeisterus.jpg?direct&280|}}| | |{{:video:piston_slap_on_2000_sportster_by_groovemeisterus.mp4|}}| {{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_-_piston_to_head_contact_pic1_by_groovemeisterus.jpg?direct&280|}}| {{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_-_piston_to_head_contact_pic2_by_groovemeisterus.jpg?direct&280|}}| | ||
| - | | Light witness marks from piston contact with valve. ((photos by BlackBikeDave of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1877254&highlight=noises&page=4)) ||| | + | | Light witness marks from piston contact with valve. ((photos by BlackBikeDave of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/174956-loud-clanking-on-startup/page4?t=1877254&highlight=noises&page=4)) ||| |
| |{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_1_by_blackbikedave.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_2_by_blackbikedave.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_5_by_blackbikedave.jpg?direct&300|}}| | |{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_1_by_blackbikedave.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_2_by_blackbikedave.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_5_by_blackbikedave.jpg?direct&300|}}| | ||
| - | | Heavy witness marks from piston contact with valve. ((photos by 04xl1200c of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1836174)) ||| | + | | Heavy witness marks from piston contact with valve. ((photos by 04xl1200c of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/rubber-mount-sportster-motorcycle-talk-2004-2006/171129-04-1200c-40k-mi-engine-failure?t=1836174)) ||| |
| |{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_2_by_04xl1200c.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_1_by_04xl1200c.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_3_by_04xl1200c.jpg?direct&300|}}| | |{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_2_by_04xl1200c.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_1_by_04xl1200c.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:genmsr:piston_slap_3_by_04xl1200c.jpg?direct&300|}}| | ||
| \\ | \\ | ||
| Line 502: | Line 487: | ||
| **Conditions**: \\ | **Conditions**: \\ | ||
| - | A mis-aligned crankshaft can result in piston skirt slapping at the case opening. ((rejeanprimeau of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1535961&highlight=stethoscope)) \\ | + | A mis-aligned crankshaft can result in piston skirt slapping at the case opening. ((rejeanprimeau of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/141782-engine-noise-i-m-stumped?t=1535961&highlight=stethoscope)) \\ |
| - | Bearing issue: Knocking really beats the pistons, rings and bearings up. ((jessearias of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=3539328&highlight=stethoscope#post3539328)) \\ | + | Bearing issue: Knocking really beats the pistons, rings and bearings up. ((jessearias of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/124708-loud-tapping-front-cyl-exhaust-note-change-help?highlight=stethoscope#post2615797)) \\ |
| You may have beat a rod bearing into submission. \\ | You may have beat a rod bearing into submission. \\ | ||
| Typically, stock crank pins and rod bearings are the weakest point in a sportster lower end. \\ | Typically, stock crank pins and rod bearings are the weakest point in a sportster lower end. \\ | ||
