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techtalk:ref:genmsr06 [2019/03/27 18:01] hippysmack created |
techtalk:ref:genmsr06 [2024/01/17 21:24] (current) hippysmack |
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====== REF: General-MSR 06 ====== | ====== REF: General-MSR 06 ====== | ||
====== Using a Stethoscope or Other to Hunt Down Engine Noises ====== | ====== Using a Stethoscope or Other to Hunt Down Engine Noises ====== | ||
+ | See also [[techtalk:ref:genmsr05#hunting_down_sportster_noises|Hunting Down Sportster Noises]] in the Sportsterpedia for examples of what some noises sound like and their origin. \\ | ||
- | When you're riding, it's even harder to pinpoint where the noise is generating from. ((Ivan RoachCoach of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=977525&page=2)) \\ | + | Normally, you'd use all of your senses on an engine. ((Ferrous Head of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/107497-using-a-stethoscope-to-listen-to-the-engine/page3?t=977525&page=3)) \\ |
+ | Look at it, (oil leaks ?, obvious bad signs). \\ | ||
+ | Listen to it, (both with and without a stick). \\ | ||
+ | Feel it, (try a broken crank one time!). \\ | ||
+ | Smell it, (bad gas or oil?). \\ | ||
+ | But like anyone diagnosing things, experience gives you the ability. It just takes time. | ||
+ | |||
+ | The "sounds" in a Sportster engine can be quite disturbing, very much like the engine is going to blow up. ((IronMick of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/98047-ironhead-noise?t=832376)) \\ | ||
+ | Literally like a tin can of marbles. \\ | ||
+ | What you need to do is to determine if it is the normal sound or if something is wrong. \\ | ||
+ | It is very difficult, almost impossible, to isolate the source of a noise while riding. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | There are pros and cons (as in other subjects) to using this listening method. \\ | ||
+ | Sound, and it's interpretation, is a totally subjective thing. \\ | ||
+ | What 'sounds' bad to one doesn't to another. \\ | ||
+ | You'll here noises from all over the engine. ((Ferrous Head of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/107497-using-a-stethoscope-to-listen-to-the-engine/page4?t=977525&page=4)) \\ | ||
+ | The trick is being able to decipher which ones come from where and if they sound correct or not. \\ | ||
+ | Unfortunately, experience is the best teacher here and you do need a known good engine as a reference point. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | However, this method can be used to hear differences in moving parts in the engine. \\ | ||
+ | Using a stethoscope is an excellent way of comparing similar areas, such as lifters, pushrods, etc. ((ericfreeman of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/107497-using-a-stethoscope-to-listen-to-the-engine/page2?t=977525&page=2)) \\ | ||
+ | A slightly tight valve train won't make the same sound as a properly adjusted valve. \\ | ||
+ | But it's readily apparent when using a stethoscope. Same for rocker arms. \\ | ||
+ | A quick probe around with a stethoscope now and then alleviates some worry about what might be missed otherwise. \\ | ||
+ | The 'scope' is just another tool to find the general area of the noise. \\ | ||
+ | And there is nothing wrong with using all the tools at your disposal to diagnose and troubleshoot. \\ | ||
+ | It still can be difficult to nail down the exact cause of the noise without visual inspection of the parts. \\ | ||
+ | When you first try it, you're likely trying to pinpoint the source of a particular sound to isolate the area you'd need to disassemble. \\ | ||
+ | But, in some instances, it can be like chasing ghosts by trying to do this with a stethoscope. \\ | ||
+ | The unfortunate reality is that you'll have to break the motor down into 'sections by section' to track down what's ailing it. ((Ivan RoachCoach of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/107497-using-a-stethoscope-to-listen-to-the-engine?t=977525)) \\ | ||
+ | That's a hard pill to swallow if the noise you hear is not detrimental by nature. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | Or, bite the bullet and take it to an experienced wrench with enough experience to at least narrow things down a bit. \\ | ||
+ | But that may also be a subjective opinion. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | This method is also good for detecting air leaks. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | When you're riding, it's even harder to pinpoint where the noise is generating from. ((Ivan RoachCoach of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/107497-using-a-stethoscope-to-listen-to-the-engine/page2?t=977525&page=2)) \\ | ||
You can use a stethoscope, screwdriver or a length of hose or an older method with a wooden stick. \\ | You can use a stethoscope, screwdriver or a length of hose or an older method with a wooden stick. \\ | ||
A stethoscope can be purchased inexpensively at Princess Auto, Harbor Freight or others. \\ | A stethoscope can be purchased inexpensively at Princess Auto, Harbor Freight or others. \\ | ||
- | If you haven't listened to your healthy engine before with either screwdriver or stethoscope etc., ((thefrenchowl of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=977525)) \\ | + | If you haven't listened to your healthy engine before with either screwdriver or stethoscope etc., ((thefrenchowl of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/107497-using-a-stethoscope-to-listen-to-the-engine?t=977525)) \\ |
You've got no reference or comparison as to what you should be listening to when your engine isn't so healthy. \\ | You've got no reference or comparison as to what you should be listening to when your engine isn't so healthy. \\ | ||
With a bit of experience, it's easier with these to pin point if you're listening to a full speed or a half-speed noise. \\ | With a bit of experience, it's easier with these to pin point if you're listening to a full speed or a half-speed noise. \\ | ||
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But the 1st time you're using them on a very healthy engine, it just sounds like it's gonna blow any minute. \\ | But the 1st time you're using them on a very healthy engine, it just sounds like it's gonna blow any minute. \\ | ||
- | However, use caution when using a stethoscope. \\ | + | ====== Stethoscope ====== |
- | It has a diaphragm in the middle of the tube (attached to the probe rod) that amplifies the sounds that you are hearing. ((asasial of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=977525&page=3)) \\ | + | Use caution when using a stethoscope. \\ |
+ | It has a diaphragm in the middle of the tube (attached to the probe rod) that amplifies the sounds that you are hearing. ((asasial of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/98047-ironhead-noise?t=832376)) \\ | ||
This amplified sound can hurt your ears when simply scraping the probe across engine parts (or even your finger). \\ | This amplified sound can hurt your ears when simply scraping the probe across engine parts (or even your finger). \\ | ||
- | |Mechanic stethoscope. ((photos by asasial of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=977525&page=3)) \\ The black partition at the end of the tape measure is where the diaphragm is. Note the size of the diaphragm.|| | + | |Mechanic stethoscope. ((photos by asasial of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/107497-using-a-stethoscope-to-listen-to-the-engine/page3?t=977525&page=3)) \\ The black partition at the end of the tape measure is where the diaphragm is. Note the size of the diaphragm.|| |
|{{:techtalk:ref:tools:stethoscope_1_by_asasial.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:tools:stethoscope_2_by_asasial.jpg?direct&300|}}| | |{{:techtalk:ref:tools:stethoscope_1_by_asasial.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:tools:stethoscope_2_by_asasial.jpg?direct&300|}}| | ||
- | A wooden dowel also works well. ((patrickd of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=977525&page=3)) \\ | + | A wooden dowel also works well (transfers noises well). ((patrickd of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/107497-using-a-stethoscope-to-listen-to-the-engine/page2?t=977525&page=3)) \\ |
Hold one end to the engine and stick the other end against your ear. \\ | Hold one end to the engine and stick the other end against your ear. \\ | ||
The dowel not only lets you hear the sounds but it will also let you feel them. \\ | The dowel not only lets you hear the sounds but it will also let you feel them. \\ | ||
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A stethoscope may sound louder in this instance. \\ | A stethoscope may sound louder in this instance. \\ | ||
But a wooden dowel may feel a harder tap easier. \\ | But a wooden dowel may feel a harder tap easier. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | You can hear soft and loud noises as well as feel light ticking to hard knocking sounds. \\ | ||
+ | A wooden handle screwdriver, hammer or a length of 2x4 will also work. \\ | ||
+ | Place one end on the area you're listening to and the other to your ear. \\ | ||
+ | Sound is transferred through the wood. \\ | ||
+ | |||
+ | | A wooden dowel for a listening tool. ((photos by Hippysmack)) || | ||
+ | |{{:techtalk:ref:tools:listening_stick_1_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}}|{{:techtalk:ref:tools:listening_stick_2_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}}| | ||
+ | |||
**With the engine at idle listen at**: | **With the engine at idle listen at**: |