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techtalk:ih:engmech07a [2019/12/06 06:26] hippysmack [Timing the Breather Valve] |
techtalk:ih:engmech07a [2023/12/26 20:32] hippysmack |
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| ====== Finding the advance timing mark on the flywheel ====== | ====== Finding the advance timing mark on the flywheel ====== | ||
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| {{:techtalk:ih:engctl:timing_mark_1_by_finkrod67_annotated_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300 |}} | {{:techtalk:ih:engctl:timing_mark_1_by_finkrod67_annotated_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300 |}} | ||
| - | The flywheel needs to be positioned so the advance timing mark on the front cylinder is in the timing window. ((photo by FinkRod67 of the XLFORUM annotated by Hippysmack http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1427992)) The single vertical line in most ironhead motors indicates the advance mark used for timing with a timing light. ((72 Ironhead XLH of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1731068)) This line is also used for setting the breather and has nothing to do with pinion gear marks, cam marks or TDC of the pistons. \\ | + | The flywheel needs to be positioned so the advance timing mark on the front cylinder is in the timing window. ((photo by FinkRod67 of the XLFORUM annotated by Hippysmack https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/133054-multiple-timing-marks?t=1427992)) The single vertical line in most ironhead motors indicates the advance mark used for timing with a timing light. ((72 Ironhead XLH of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/161221-oil-pump-timing-confirmation?t=1731068)) This line is also used for setting the breather and has nothing to do with pinion gear marks, cam marks or TDC of the pistons. \\ |
| The FSM says to remove the timing plug, rotate the engine until the advance timing mark is centered in the timing hole. \\ | The FSM says to remove the timing plug, rotate the engine until the advance timing mark is centered in the timing hole. \\ | ||
| See also [[techtalk:ih:engctl01#timing_marks|Timing Marks]] in the IH section of the Sportsterpedia for the correct factory advance marks. \\ | See also [[techtalk:ih:engctl01#timing_marks|Timing Marks]] in the IH section of the Sportsterpedia for the correct factory advance marks. \\ | ||
| \\ \\ \\ \\ \\ | \\ \\ \\ \\ \\ | ||
| - | **However, any particular bike may not have the original flywheels**. So it is most important to always do a simple check to verify which mark to use on the flywheel. ((IronMick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1731068)) \\ | + | **However, any particular bike may not have the original flywheels**. So it is most important to always do a simple check to verify which mark to use on the flywheel. ((IronMick of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/161221-oil-pump-timing-confirmation?t=1731068)) \\ |
| Aftermarket flywheels have been know to have the timing marks cut wrong also. \\ | Aftermarket flywheels have been know to have the timing marks cut wrong also. \\ | ||
| - | Pull the front spark plug, and using a wooden dowel or a drinking straw, feel the piston come up as you rotate the engine. ((shovithead of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1731068)) \\ | + | Pull the front spark plug, and using a wooden dowel or a drinking straw, feel the piston come up as you rotate the engine. ((shovithead of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/161221-oil-pump-timing-confirmation?t=1731068)) \\ |
| Before it gets to the top, the advance mark will show. As the piston hits the top of the stroke, the TDC mark will come up. \\ | Before it gets to the top, the advance mark will show. As the piston hits the top of the stroke, the TDC mark will come up. \\ | ||
| The first mark to come up makes the motor fire "earlier" than the second dot to come up. \\ | The first mark to come up makes the motor fire "earlier" than the second dot to come up. \\ | ||
| Line 24: | Line 23: | ||
| Normally. a single vertical line is the advance timing mark on earlier ironheads, not the dot. \\ | Normally. a single vertical line is the advance timing mark on earlier ironheads, not the dot. \\ | ||
| - | To state it another way, rotate the motor forward until the front piston tops out. ((ryder rick of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1936552&page=4)) \\ | + | To state it another way, rotate the motor forward until the front piston tops out. ((ryder rick of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/180166-how-do-i-retime-the-timing-crankcase-breather-to-my-pinion-shaft/page4?t=1936552&page=4)) \\ |
| Check the mark, that is front TDC. \\ | Check the mark, that is front TDC. \\ | ||
| Now slowly rotate the motor backwards and the first mark you come to will be the front (advanced) timing mark for timing the breather valve. \\ | Now slowly rotate the motor backwards and the first mark you come to will be the front (advanced) timing mark for timing the breather valve. \\ | ||
| Line 43: | Line 42: | ||
| Line up the timing hole on the breather sleeve gear on the oil pump to be in the notch (window) in the front. It may take a few tries to roll it into place. \\ | Line up the timing hole on the breather sleeve gear on the oil pump to be in the notch (window) in the front. It may take a few tries to roll it into place. \\ | ||
| Don't sweat it too much if you can't get the dot exactly centered in the notch. \\ | Don't sweat it too much if you can't get the dot exactly centered in the notch. \\ | ||
| - | It is not uncommon to have the DOT slightly to the left just entering the notch of the pump. ((Monte03 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=170686&page=2)) \\ | + | It is not uncommon to have the DOT slightly to the left just entering the notch of the pump. ((Monte03 of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/46472-timing-oil-pump/page2?t=170686&page=2)) \\ |
| - | **Then reinstall the pinion gear**. It should have one larger spline to engage the shaft and it can only go on one way and have the line facing out. ((chevelle of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=170686&page=3)) \\ | + | **Then reinstall the pinion gear**. It should have one larger spline to engage the shaft and it can only go on one way and have the line facing out. ((chevelle of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/46472-timing-oil-pump/page3?t=170686&page=3)) \\ |
| It's a light press fit onto the pinion shaft. \\ | It's a light press fit onto the pinion shaft. \\ | ||
| You can heat the gear up in a grill, oven or with a propane torch just enough to make it expand enough to slide it back on the pinion shaft. \\ | You can heat the gear up in a grill, oven or with a propane torch just enough to make it expand enough to slide it back on the pinion shaft. \\ | ||
| It should not be heated to 'red hot' but just enough to allow it to expand some. \\ | It should not be heated to 'red hot' but just enough to allow it to expand some. \\ | ||
| - | {{:techtalk:ih:engmech:pre-77_installing_pinion_gear_by_canadiantux.jpg?direct&300 |}} | + | {{:techtalk:ih:engmech:pre-77_installing_pinion_gear_by_canadiantux.jpg?direct&300|}} |
| - | The pinion gear should be installed onto the shaft so that the outer face of the gear is 5/16" outboard of the gasket surface. ((needspeed of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5792984#post5792984)) ((photo by CanadianTux of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1708831&page=11)) \\ | + | Pinion gear should be installed onto shaft so the outer face of the gear is 5/16" outboard of the gasket surface. ((needspeed of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-bottom-end/197307-sportster-crankcase-pressure-engine-breathing-wetsumping-and-mods/page59#post4360067)) ((photo by CanadianTux of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/159403-hardtail-advice-oil-pump-help-71-xlch/page11?t=1708831&page=11)) \\ |
| In that position the oil pump drive gear has a lot of end play between the shaft shoulder and the back of the pinion gear as shown in your picture. \\ | In that position the oil pump drive gear has a lot of end play between the shaft shoulder and the back of the pinion gear as shown in your picture. \\ | ||
| When the engine runs the drive gear is thrust against the back of the pinion gear. \\ | When the engine runs the drive gear is thrust against the back of the pinion gear. \\ | ||
| Line 61: | Line 60: | ||
| Once the breather valve is correctly timed, the position of the flywheel and breather valve timing marks can be disregarded when installing timing gears (cams). \\ | Once the breather valve is correctly timed, the position of the flywheel and breather valve timing marks can be disregarded when installing timing gears (cams). \\ | ||
| - | {{:techtalk:ih:engmech:timing_the_breather_valve_1_by_canadiantux_annotated_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Canadian Tux of the XLFORUM )) {{:techtalk:ih:engmech:ih_oil_pump_timing_by_hotrods316.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by hotrods316 of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=170686&page=3)) {{:techtalk:ih:engmech:ih_oil_pump_timing_by_cbellamore.png?direct&300|}} ((photo by cbellamore of the XLFORUM annotated by Hippysmack)) \\ | + | {{:techtalk:ih:engmech:timing_the_breather_valve_1_by_canadiantux_annotated_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Canadian Tux of the XLFORUM)) {{:techtalk:ih:engmech:ih_oil_pump_timing_by_hotrods316.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by hotrods316 of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/ironhead-sportster-motorcycle-talk-1957-1985/46472-timing-oil-pump/page3?t=170686&page=3)) {{:techtalk:ih:engmech:ih_oil_pump_timing_by_cbellamore.png?direct&300|}} ((photo by cbellamore of the XLFORUM annotated by Hippysmack)) \\ |
